One of my favorite things about the "social network" hiding in @Hypothes_is is that there's a sort of article I can visit & all my favorite friends & thinkers have already marked it to pieces! Hello! @flancian @TrailMarks @kixiQu @moonlion_eth #PKM
https:/
On the flip side, I'm glad I have a counter example of what good commenting is. I took a screenshot and will use it as an exercise for my Lean PKM course.
Countering false assertions with a total misunderstanding or hiding behind an avatar are poor practices
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
the level of the annotations is also depressing. It's social on it's worst aspect.
I dunno the author but why should a divergent opinion be hammered like that?
Either I read and want to be clear of an echo chamber, do my own critical thinking or pls share a critical summary
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
All for divergent opinions.
4 me the very idea of Knowledge Management itself is suspect.
But the article starts with claim that PKM
"is a trendy new term"
'Tain't what you don't know that get's you into trouble. It's what you know for sure is ain't so."
Trendy yes, new no
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I dunno who is the guy who replied, but replying about PKM with a mention of KM is a _total_ misunderstanding.
It's something I explain about stack of ideas in my Lesson 9. He should start by having the concepts right.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I think also about @flancian that when someone wants to have public opinions on someone else work, the first step is to disclose your identity, where you live and who pays you.
If you are a joke, your opinion is also a joke but not a funny one.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
there's also annotations.lindylearn.io/page/?url=http…
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
✨That's actually how I came across it, but it's not as obvious with that UI how one might participate. ;)
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I feel like there is power in not controlling what people say about you. Let's say this was a nazi article. The allowed comments would be heavily moderated and you wouldn't see the real picture
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I was thinking also a grace period for public comments during which the author can correct or respond. Otherwise annotations will become a thing of the past like blog comments.
And a general evaluation, if all comments are negative, deprioritize them until a trend appears.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I'm sure @dwhly has ideas on filtering public annotations too!
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
no because several commentators would go in the same direction.
But you're true in fine you have to deal with hate, extreem opinions, moderation.
Means that Twitter moderation and cred impacts everything else.
Surely not lost to the buyer
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Yeah this page is just meant to give an overview of the conversations -- I think the actual hypothesis client works perfectly for replying!
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I love that Peter jumped into this convo
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Oh, I'm sorry that was your impression! I guess I think of annotations as always belonging to *optional* overlay, and because of this I think all opinions should be welcome by default; in particular divergent ones?
But perhaps I misunderstand your point, could you expand?
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Maybe he meant that too many social comments written from the same perspective can give a false sense of agreement -- but that's the fault of insufficient filtering by the tool, not the authors.
All optional as you said.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
*all non-violent opinions, I'd perhaps say.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I'm failing to see how annotations are any different than blog comments in that regard? Maybe they have the same opinion about those?
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
"Start by being right" is a tall order though ;) We are all learning here! Aren't we?
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Yeah, same problem as for any social comments. But comments on the article site itself are often moderated by the author?
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
If learning consists in sharing vague half baked opinions how will others learn?
Where ends learning by approximation and starts thinking ?
Learning is too good an excuse
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Sorry but I didn't get this! Could you explain?
Do you mean I should have disclosed where I live/who I work for in a particular annotation/post? Or someone else should?
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I feel like personal data management is ... personal
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
The fact is, screenshots of google popularity I did since 30 years, that PKM was almost not used until 2 years ago. First appeared in Polanyi's book, printed 1958 but very rarely used due to confusion.
I don't even think many people agree on a definition.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
the link @moonlion_eth shared displays annotations right next to the text in overlap on my mobile phone. No way to see them as optional.
My goal was to get an idea of the added value of the 'social' annotations.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I'm somewhat biased cause I'm friends with the person who made that site lol
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
You know our project anagora.org is pretty much an amalgamation of half baked opinions on purpose yeah?
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Just because google does not surface it it does not mean it does not exist.
Ideas are no poularity contests.
docs.google.com/document/d/1zw…
personalknowledge.org
The link in my profile used to be a link to my LinkedIn profile. The current link has that too
linkedin.com/in/gyuri-lajos/
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Tbh i was confused too
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
cf when I said critical thinking is the lost part of PKM.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
... Annotations are more intrusive compared to comments and the social is supposed to bring credibility, unless people use different handles or unrelated to people's name. Hence the convo.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
yes, I blocked it
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I mean that hiding behind a handle reduces your credibilty to nil. Are you a troll or a valid human? I can't tell.
Why not having a complete bio?
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
there is a connection between this account and the gyuri of the comment?
How could I know? why not simply using first and last names?
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I'm back on a desktop:) better view.
I realize that from the annotation (no affordance on your name), to hypothesis profile to researchgate it's a long rabbit trail.
Your linkedin link is not a link, anyway I dropped my account at li. Why not link directly to a personal page?
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Thank you for sharing your opinion! Your words are surprising to me; it is unclear why you give so much weight to real names and assign "nil" credibility to pseudonymous opinions. Pseudonyms can be empowering, and important for the oppressed (although I am not one.)
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Just click on the gyuri link on the annotations
then MORE INFO
I am really sorry that it is turning into this exchange
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
TIL "cf"
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
In any case my bio is relatively complete I think, and my original name (which I don't see as particularly real) is well documented in several places: I am [[Eduardo Ivanec]].
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
that's the point "although I am not one.".
I'm all for pseudonyms when there is a purpose. Let's leave it to those who need it.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I'm sorry I don't have mental space to hop from one account to anither social media account to a google doc and reading it all to understand
The more so if the opinion is weak.
My point is: if you comment publicly on the work of others, use a real name and be easy to check
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I see your point but I disagree. First of all, people who have a strong need for a pseudonym would stick out, be easier to single out if only them used them.
Second we may all be oppressed in the future, might have been in the past. I was not always this privileged.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Also, some feedback from one human to another: for a complaint on quality of discourse, IMO you could have done better on communicating your concerns specifically (which annotations were bad, which ok?) and without belittling others because of how they choose to identify.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I'd happily go as far as re-considering that real names online might be correlated with higher quality of discourse -- [[real names policy]] and all seemed not to work in critical ways last time I reviewed, but times change and all.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I gave two reasons and didn't mention you specifically at first.
- Out of topic answer
- Anonymous critics ( joke-like handle)
I also didn't recognize Vera's new handle.
That's a problem with inflation if pseudonym, it's hard to keep track.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
But I don't think assigning [[nil]] credence to pseudonymous opinions makes sense, is rational or kind?
I'm happy to discuss though! Perhaps I'm missing something.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I think critical thinking is slowly becoming the forgotten part of PKM. It becomes a race of who collect, highlight, fantasize and share the most at the cost of elaboration and making real progress.
That's what motivates my reaction.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Personally i change identities on purpose because i would hate to think anyone thought i was an authority on anything lol
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Yes I noticed it but too late. I knew Vera was involved in AnAgora but not you.
I clicked on your link because I wanted to have second look at hypothesis with a fresh morning positive attitude.
It led to this long confused thread. ...
now I read the post w/o comments and ...
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
It's not so bad. There are some good points with which I agree: uber expensives courses (reason why LeanPKM) is free, absurb trend of sharing whole graph pictures.
But I totally dislike his idea that people are limited by their genetics.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
That part
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
It's quite amazing how they all ended up on the same article 😀
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
In all fairness people who commented told me about the article
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I wonder if something could be done with the UI to present social annotations as more "optional". To give a choice of seeing conversations about a paragraph while reading without being overly influenced by them.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
I feel like my role in life is to be the divergent opinion lol
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Maybe something like this -- just showing a dot for each "point of public conversation" after the quote they reference. The actual annotation would only appear if you click on that dot, you have to make up your own opinion first.
, May 14 2022 on twitter.com
Hi Gyuri! I was actually looking for the people behind Trail Marks a few weeks ago, interesting project! Big Memex fan myself, would love to learn more. What's the best way to reach out? I follow you with my project's account, but can't DM. Anyways, nice to find you! Cheers~
, May 15 2022 on twitter.com
Please try again
, May 15 2022 on twitter.com
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Also on: @ChrisAldrich
Generally I read a work and make my own annotations/observations first before reading/interacting with others for this very reason. I was just struck that I'd run across an article with so many annotators that I happened to know, an event… stream.boffosocko.com/2022/brunowinc…
Chris Aldrich, May 14 2022 on twitter.com